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Thread: OT- The Yanks can save the Mets AND become even better

  1. #1

    OT- The Yanks can save the Mets AND become even better

    I know this will NEVER EVER happen because the team simply will not trade wiht each other but...

    The Mets are a mess and in desparate need of talent infusion evrywhere.

    The Yanks are on the verge of sustained greatness but lack one thing the Red Sox already have...an established ace.

    So, I am proposing this trade:

    The Yanks send the Mets: Miguel Andujar, Delin Betances, Austin Romine, Jordan Montgomery and either Clint Frazier OR Tyler Austin.

    The Mets send the Yankees: Noah Syndegaard and Kevin Plawiecki

    Rationale:

    Mets get their future 3Bman to replace Wright. Much need bullpen help in Betances who could set up Familia or they could make him their new closer. Romine isnt the big bat they but would immediately become their everyday cathcer and in the NL could be a .260/15/70 guy for them. Montgomery slides right into the #3 or 4 spot in the rotation and has nice upside to be even better, Frazier gives them a stud OF prospect to go with Cespedes and Conforto (who would have to move to CF) or they could take Austin if they think Dom Smith isnt the answer. But now the Mets have SOME semblence of a young up and coming line up with Smith, Reyes, Rosario and Andujar in the infield. Cespedes, Conforto and Frazier in the OF and Romine behind the plate. And only Cespedes would be costing them big bucks so they could still sign a FA or two (an OF if they take Austin instead of Frazier). Plus it still leaves them with DeGrom (ace), Matz, Harvey (?), Wheeler (?), Montgomery, Gsellman, Montero and Lugo to put together a rotation with. And Familia, Betances, Ramos and Blevins in the pen. Thats not bad at all.

    From the Yanks standpoint it is a LOT to give up and will deplete their "kiddie corp" quite a bit. BUT, they are set in RF, C, 2B, and SS for the foreseeable future. They have a top level kid already at 1B and another coming in Torres (who should move Castro to 3B blocking Andujar anyway). They are "committed" to Ellsbury and have Hicks who may be able to take over a full time role if Gardy goes. They could even bring back HOliday for another year. In return they get a true young ace who they know can handle NY and a decent insurance backup to Sanchez to replace Romine. I HATE giving up Montgomery but you have to give to get and even when they let CC walk away and Tanaka (possible) goes, it still leaves a top of the rotation of Noah, Severino, and Gray which would be as good as any 1-2-3 in baseball. They also are freeing up a TON of money (CC, Arod, and Pineda come off the books and possibly Tanaka) and could use it on a high-mid rotation pitcher (or maybe Tanaka stays as a #4!) AND they still have Sheffield and Adams on the way up. In the pen, you still have Chapman, Green, Kahnle, Warren, HOlder and Robertson which even wiohtout Delin is still dominant. AND lets not forget that in all likelihood the Yanks will be making at least ONE big splash in FA NEXT off season when Machado, Harper, etc are available.

    I am very curious what Larry thinks about this deal and also any Mets and Sox fans. To me its a risky deal for both teams as we are dealing wiht mostly prospects and Noah is coming off injury. But I thinin its a risk worth taking for both teams.
    Last edited by MSGold12; 09-29-2017 at 03:31 PM.

  2. #2
    I find it funny that Yankee fans have suddenly rejoined the fold. A very short time ago I was told no one cares about MLB anymore.

    (BTW, even aces are not foolproof. Sale has been lit up a couple times recently..)

    (Also, did you have trouble opening this in the OT Lounge? I keep getting server errors..)

  3. #3
    1. If you are inclouding me in your little "fold" theory then you are highly mistaken. Up until last years trade deadline I was HIGHLY critical of the Yanks contiunued strategy to keep putting vetreran band aids on the wound. They were boring and not winning. Now, they are FINALLY doing whjat fans like me have been clamouring for for years and yes they are a HELL oif a lot more fun to watch now then they have been the last few years despite winning about the same number of games. How you make the leap form that to people telling you "no one cares" is kind of comical. Go find me any post where I sad I no longer "care" about the Yanks.

    2. I was interested in your opinion of the trade...not your snarky bullshit. I think its a trade that makes both teams significantly better.

    3. I didnt try to put it in the OTL. I put it here since it was sports related.
    Last edited by MSGold12; 09-29-2017 at 04:40 PM.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by MSGold12 View Post
    I know this will NEVER EVER happen because the team simply will not trade wiht each other but...

    The Mets are a mess and in desparate need of talent infusion evrywhere.

    The Yanks are on the verge of sustained greatness but lack one thing the Red Sox already have...an established ace.

    So, I am proposing this trade:

    The Yanks send the Mets: Miguel Andujar, Delin Betances, Austin Romine, Jordan Montgomery and either Clint Frazier OR Tyler Austin.

    The Mets send the Yankees: Noah Syndegaard and Kevin Plawiecki

    Rationale:

    Mets get their future 3Bman to replace Wright. Much need bullpen help in Betances who could set up Familia or they could make him their new closer. Romine isnt the big bat they but would immediately become their everyday cathcer and in the NL could be a .260/15/70 guy for them. Montgomery slides right into the #3 or 4 spot in the rotation and has nice upside to be even better, Frazier gives them a stud OF prospect to go with Cespedes and Conforto (who would have to move to CF) or they could take Austin if they think Dom Smith isnt the answer. But now the Mets have SOME semblence of a young up and coming line up with Smith, Reyes, Rosario and Andujar in the infield. Cespedes, Conforto and Frazier in the OF and Romine behind the plate. And only Cespedes would be costing them big bucks so they could still sign a FA or two (an OF if they take Austin instead of Frazier). Plus it still leaves them with DeGrom (ace), Matz, Harvey (?), Wheeler (?), Montgomery, Gsellman, Montero and Lugo to put together a rotation with. And Familia, Betances, Ramos and Blevins in the pen. Thats not bad at all.

    From the Yanks standpoint it is a LOT to give up and will deplete their "kiddie corp" quite a bit. BUT, they are set in RF, C, 2B, and SS for the foreseeable future. They have a top level kid already at 1B and another coming in Torres (who should move Castro to 3B blocking Andujar anyway). They are "committed" to Ellsbury and have Hicks who may be able to take over a full time role if Gardy goes. They could even bring back HOliday for another year. In return they get a true young ace who they know can handle NY and a decent insurance backup to Sanchez to replace Romine. I HATE giving up Montgomery but you have to give to get and even when they let CC walk away and Tanaka (possible) goes, it still leaves a top of the rotation of Noah, Severino, and Gray which would be as good as any 1-2-3 in baseball. They also are freeing up a TON of money (CC, Arod, and Pineda come off the books and possibly Tanaka) and could use it on a high-mid rotation pitcher (or maybe Tanaka stays as a #4!) AND they still have Sheffield and Adams on the way up. In the pen, you still have Chapman, Green, Kahnle, Warren, HOlder and Robertson which even wiohtout Delin is still dominant. AND lets not forget that in all likelihood the Yanks will be making at least ONE big splash in FA NEXT off season when Machado, Harper, etc are available.

    I am very curious what Larry thinks about this deal and also any Mets and Sox fans. To me its a risky deal for both teams as we are dealing wiht mostly prospects and Noah is coming off injury. But I thinin its a risk worth taking for both teams.
    Well, I'm always interested in Syndergaard, however, there ARE issues.

    1. I wouldn't sell low on Betances, he's unhittable when right.

    2. Jordan Montgomery had a BETTER rookie season than Andy Pettitte, arguably and based on advanced statistics.He is under control for a very long time at low dollars.

    3. Don't think Romine has much if any value, he is a legit ML Buc but apparently that's all

    4. not a huge fan of Sonny Gray and 5'10 pitchers pushing 30, none have succeeded or have had along career after age 30 in a long time, stats don't show good for under 5'11- 6 pitchers even if Pedro and his roids lasted longer.

    Hal is serious about getting under the luxury tax and well he should be, young replaceable when they get expensive players are the future.
    As much as I like Castro and Didi, doubt both remain when both are expensive soon, Torres is being groomed IMO for 2nd base, not 3rd.
    Cashman should be horse whipped for not getting Sale, he had the pieces, had the chips but allowed Red Sucks to get him instead, stupid.

    Of course I would want Syndergaard , Mets would demand Gleyber Torres, Estefan Florial both and probably two- three more top Yankees prospects.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by leftylarry View Post
    Well, I'm always interested in Syndergaard, however, there ARE issues.

    1. I wouldn't sell low on Betances, he's unhittable when right.

    2. Jordan Montgomery had a BETTER rookie season than Andy Pettitte, arguably and based on advanced statistics.He is under control for a very long time at low dollars.

    3. Don't think Romine has much if any value, he is a legit ML Buc but apparently that's all

    4. not a huge fan of Sonny Gray and 5'10 pitchers pushing 30, none have succeeded or have had along career after age 30 in a long time, stats don't show good for under 5'11- 6 pitchers even if Pedro and his roids lasted longer.

    Hal is serious about getting under the luxury tax and well he should be, young replaceable when they get expensive players are the future.
    As much as I like Castro and Didi, doubt both remain when both are expensive soon, Torres is being groomed IMO for 2nd base, not 3rd.
    Cashman should be horse whipped for not getting Sale, he had the pieces, had the chips but allowed Red Sucks to get him instead, stupid.

    Of course I would want Syndergaard , Mets would demand Gleyber Torres, Estefan Florial both and probably two- three more top Yankees prospects.
    1. I dont see getting a true #1 like Syndegaard as "selling low".
    2. I love MOntgomery (was goig to make a Pettite comparison althogh I think Pettites roookie nyear in 95 was still better) and it pained me to add him to the trade but the Mets need some stability in their rotation and he could privide that...and cheap
    3. Romine is already better then any C the Mes have and they will be in the market for one this off season anyweay
    4. Agreed (although I think Gray is 27) but If you have Noah and Luis at the top, Gray is a REALLY good #3.

    I understand about the lux tax but I think they only need to get under it for 1 year to qualify and with CC, Ariod and maybe Tanaka off the books, htey might qualify this off season

    Yes, agreed Torres is being groomed for 2B...moving Castro to 3B.

    To me Torres is the only untouchable. So how about this:

    Betances, Andujar, Florial, Romine, and Frazier for Syndergaard and PLawecki. Florial replaces MOntgomery in the deal. They get a blue chip prospect in Florial, a potential closer, a decent sytarting catcher, a major leage ready potential starting 3B prospect, a major league exerienced starting OF prospect.

    Thats still a lot to give up but the Yanks get an ace AND keep Montgomery. If I have to throw in MOntogomery to get it done then I want some SP back also (Gsellman? Lugo? Montero?) I have to think the Mets would have to consider it...if it werent the Yanks of course.

  6. #6
    I will be as objective as possible as a Sox fan...

    Trade on paper pretty much works. For me though, if I'm running the Yanks I'd rather buy pitchers and keep my farm, even though next year's class of FA doesn't have an abundance of legit aces. Kershaw COULD become one, and choosing to become one when going to NY to pitch out the rest of your career for the historic Yankees with a fantastic lineup of young players already in place, well, that is not a stretch at all. He had some back issues this year, that's not a warm fuzzy thing, but hey, Syndegaard is coming off a major injury himself, these are things that are always in play. I'd say Kershaw opting out to come to the legendary Yanks who are posied to contend for the entire duration of his career is more likely than the Mets agreeing to trade an ace to the Yankees, as you already said anyway how unlikely that would be.

    So yeah, for me from a Yankee side I like the farm. I think the farm is HARDER to attain than a strong rotation WHEN (and this is of course key) you can spend like the Yankees can. Larry mentioned Sale and he's right, of course the Yankees should have signed him, and of course the Sox should have signed him, and did. But IMO as great as it is to have an ace, an overall strong caliber rotation is even better and when you are a contender lineup and have the ability to spend at the highest limits of the sport, you can BUY rotations and you can be successful without one true dominant ace. And again, Kershaw is an ace and could be enticed to come east IMO with that kind of a carrot.

    And with that said, Lord I hope that doesn't happen!!!!!!! LOL
    Last edited by JWilly; 09-29-2017 at 05:19 PM.

  7. #7
    Betances has little value off a difficult season and pending arbitration followed by free agency, Mets aren't stupid, you'd have to sell low on him.
    Montgomery has value , why trade him if you're keeping all the costly relief pitchers to come in after 6 innings anyway.
    A guy showed all the pitching sabremetrics on Pettitte and Montgomery and Monty wins in almost all.These youngsters don't care about wins/ losses anymore, though I do.
    I would say getting Syndergaard would look something like : Gleyber Torres, Estefan Florial, Andujar, Tate/Abreu ( or equivalent) and maybe the two Domigoes,
    Doubt Mets would be interested in Chance Adams or Justis Sheffield both are limited prospects who are overhyped, Domingo German probably is in their class, might actually have more upside.
    Yankees best pitching prospects IMO are : Albert Abreu, Domingo Acevedo, Dillon Tate, Jorge Guzman, Freicer Perez ( personal favorite) Brian Keller ( 39th rd steal) and then the top 4-5 guys they drafted this season all of whom have a real chance to make Yankees look smart, though I'm skeptical about the first Rounder who had TJ surgery.
    Last edited by leftylarry; 09-29-2017 at 06:04 PM.

  8. #8
    Red Sox didn't sign Sale, they traded a lot of top prospects for him, Yankees could have matched the offer to white Sox easily.
    Baseball salaries won't be rising anymore and Yankees are out of the free agency market.
    They will offer CC Sabathia much less to resign for 1-2 seasons, like 11-12 million per tops and I'm sure they will let Tanaka walk and hope he walks on his opt out.
    In the future Yankees money will be used on the FARM system, not going into luxury tax which helps the competition, Hal is sick of paying them and he's right and most fans agree.
    Our advantage should be in minor league facilities, coaching, equipment and getting players to develop, that's where we'll put the money.

  9. #9
    MSG, Frazier has ALWAYS had his doubters.
    The athleticsm and swingspeed special, the make up, just OK and the success on the field, somewhat sporatic .
    He needed to beat up on triple A pitching and he didn't.
    Some scouts think his upside is a ML average starting OF'er tops.

  10. #10
    One last thing, more and more Yankee hierarchy believe Nick Solak may be the second baseman of the future, all the guy does is, hit, run, fielding better every day and wins.
    Classic, knows how to play guy.

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